His Wife's Reply to "What do I do/say? (wife too tired for sex but plenty of energy to workout)"

HygeniusHygenius ArizonaPosts: 20Silver Member
edited July 2012 in Running the MAP

WELL , I THINK ITS MY TURN.   I am x1134x's wife.  That very personal "story" is about me and this will be my first post here because I was SO INCREDIBLY HURT by what I read, I felt I needed to give my perspective and some very important information that might lead to @Athol and others giving MORE extensive advice.  Here are a few VERY IMPORTANT factors that perhaps should have been given with this post that have conveniently been negated.

1)  My old brother (5 yrs older) and only sibling just died 3 months ago today in a sudden and horrific motorcycle accident.  

We are military kids and he was also my only father figure. My father left us 14 yrs ago and I just saw him for the first time at my brothers funeral. I had to find him through the Red Cross. I workout daily and make it my FIRST priority so I don't cry ALL THE TIME. My grief counselor and therapist (yes, I see one to deal with my issues unlike my husband) recommended daily exercise to help with depression.  x1134x read on this site that being around crying women (me, my mother, my aunts, etc) all the time lowers men's testosterone and could be adding to his Beta-ness or ED issues.  So, I try not to cry at all.  Instead he wakes me up in the middle of the night to notify me that I'm crying in my sleep.  Nothing I can do about that, I dream of my brother. Sorry.


2) x1134x had not committed to MAP until 3 weeks ago.
x1134x has stated to @johnc that he has been working out for years.  We (myself and x1134x) just sat down and had a HONEST communication about that.  He admitted to having worked out perhaps 30 times in the last 6-7 years.  Average = 10 times per YEAR. His workouts have been hit and miss but approx. 3-4 times a week for those 3 weeks. (I MUST note that I have begged him to work out for years, to little success. I encouraged him to build that home gym. I funded it, as a matter of fact, when he wasn't working regularly at the time. I work out daily now but have worked out weekly off and on for many years) 

mrsozzyLiquidSound
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Comments

  • HygeniusHygenius ArizonaPosts: 20Silver Member
    edited July 2012
    3)  x1134x first found MMSL in June. Of 2012. Yes, last month.
    We have been having sexual issues since the beginning of our relationship 10 years ago.  Our first 3 months of dating consisted of attempted sex and my husband losing it before insertion.  It has continued off and on since then.  If I take charge, we lose the erection and I'm told I am too dominant.  If I give up all control and beg for it, talk dirty, tell him how much I want him, we lose erection and I'm told to wait and lets try again in 15 mins. "I'm too in my head"....rolls over and wants me to play with his penis until it works again.  I'm wet, frustrated, naked and now, feel horrible about myself. If I do, he usually comes within 5 mins and I have no time for my orgasm. I smile, tell him its ok and the sex was feeling great even if I didn't have a orgasm. I want to build his confidence FIRST to keep the erection, we can work on my orgasm when he can maintain a erection for longer.   This is the script for the last few YEARS.  I feel like one of Pavlov's dogs. I equate sex with frustration and no climax OR failure and "it must be me" low self esteem.   When I do have a orgasm (5-6 per year) it does stimulate more sex after for a while because it is usually fantastic and memorable but it is quickly squelched for the orgasm drought that follows.  My orgasm is the Snowy Owl.  A rare sight, amazing and awe inspiring, then rarely ever seen again.


    4) We were both CHRONIC marijuana smokers (8yrs) until last month. 
    My brothers death made us BOTH realize we have been medicating ourselves from our issues (putting off a family, not dealing with stress, not dealing with our sexual issues) and we now choose to address our problems and make this marriage work. Thus, us BOTH committing to working on our marriage with MMSL as a guide. 

  • HygeniusHygenius ArizonaPosts: 20Silver Member
    edited July 2012
    5) Until 3 weeks ago, I cooked 90% of the time, 10% of the time we ate out. I performed the house hold chores 95% of time. Previous to 2010, I was the major salary earner in our relationship. 


    6)  The day x1134x refered to was a 12 hour work day for me with some really difficult patients and physcially challenging. Depression and dope withdrawls aside, of course.

    So, having shared these FEW things (there are more, but lets stick to the core), is this REALLY the best time, the best way to share with me what is bothering him?  For me to read them on this site. I have encouraged him to read this because I TOTALLY agree with @Athol and his views on Alpha behavior. I want MMSL.  I want my Alpha. I know he's capable or I wouldn't have stayed and continued to try all these years.  We need to make life changes together. But isn't a little early to be posting THAT after having only committed to it for 3 weeks with some major extenuating circumstances?????  Should he have communicated this to me first in perhaps a firm but more sensitive way?  

    Am I up in the night to expect that these changes should take longer and that patience should be a factor?  10 years of difficult sex, no exercise and relationship issues can not be solved in a month and surely not after such life changing events, right?  Or am I just a cock tease that is fitness testing my husband daily with no intention of having sex with him because I just am not interested anymore....hmmm?

    I am HURT and EMBARRASSED but most of all, I'm tired.  Perhaps a trial separation would be best. 
    Suggestions anyone.

    AngelineshibariLiquidSound
  • sf64sf64 San FranciscoPosts: 1,904Silver Member
    @Hygenius -- I am not going to attempt to address everything you wrote, but there are several points I really want to address.

    1.   You wrote, "We were both CHRONIC marijuana smokers (8yrs) until last month."  There is significant research published in the last few years that indicates that for many people, marijuana usage can cause erectile dysfunction and can negatively impact female sexual function as well.  I quote from a study published last year in the online version of the Journal of Sexual Medicine.

    It appeared that THC impaired the smooth muscle’s normal function.

    This finding suggests that marijuana use could affect a man’s ability to have an erection, since the human penis is 70% to 80% smooth muscle.

    The results could have implications for women as well.

    “The erectile tissue in the penis is similar to the tissue in the clitoris in that they both have cannabinoid receptors, so cannabis use could, in theory, affect a female’s ability to become sexually aroused as well,” Dr. Shamloul told The Queen’s Journal, the student newspaper of Queen’s University.

    It is also well established that THC can remain in your body for a long time, especially in fat tissue and that as you burn fat, the THC may be released into the blood stream.

    It is quite possible that many of the "mechanical" issues the two of you have face over the last eight years may have been made worse or even caused by the use of marijuana.

    2.  None of us on the board were present when various events and discussions happened in your home and with your husband.  We can only comment on what was reported here.  

    Your husband's post asked the question was related to you being too tired for sex but not too tired to work out.  To me, that is a fair question. The fact is, by your own description above, you are working out every day and by your own words, you make it your first priority.  

    On the day in question, after your 12 hour day, did you work out?  If I am to believe what you wrote, the answer is yes.  Could you have chosen to have sex with your husband instead of working out?  Clearly the answer is yes.  If you had the energy to work out, you could have chosen you use that energy for sex, but decided not to.  

    Your post talks about a lot of things, issues and feelings, but at the end of the day, very simply put, you made working out a higher priority than sex with your husband.  And as a guy, if my wife or girlfriend came home, worked out and then begged off sex, I would be furious. 

    Please don't take any of this as an attack on your commitment to your marriage or making things better. You asked for feedback... so here it is.... I am sure others will have something to say as well.

    Note - If you a FO with a Lazy Bear or Low-T husband, ignore everything I say. It probably doesn't apply
    "As he works on his MAP, he's going to do things that piss you off. He has to."  - Steu2817
    "In a world of Alpha's there is no peace for anyone.....welcome to Somalia enjoy your stay" - Highlander2




  • LinanatiLinanati Posts: 1,606Member

    @Hygenius

    I'm sorry to hear about your brother.  It's OK to cry about that, no matter what it does to testosterone levels.  Seeking, and receiving, comfort from your spouse when you genuinely need it (such as when grieving the death of a beloved family member) increases your emotional bond and helps build a strong long-term relationship.

    It sounds like you two have a lot going on right now.  I think the first thing to do for the sexual problems is for him to have a thorough medical checkup.  A lot of doctors don't seem to want to do much to uncover medical problems.  They prefer to deal with easier things like ear infections - not much effort for the money, I guess.  He might have to go to several doctors and insist on an answer.

    Also, in x1134x's original thread, I got the feeling he was embarrassed about the ED problem.  (Could be why he didn't mention it initially.)  If possible, maybe you could go to the doctor with him and explain how long this has been going on and how it is affecting your marriage.  Because of his embarrassment about it, he might not press as hard as you would for a real answer.

    I think you're being a good wife to try to help him with this, and also to come out to MMSL and try to work on your part of your marriage.  With all the difficulties you have right now though, it might be slow going for you.  The fact that you want to try should count huge in your favor.

    It's good to meet you, and the best of luck to you both!

    PhoenixDown[Deleted User]AverageMarriedGuyHygenius
  • LinanatiLinanati Posts: 1,606Member
    Based on sf64's comment, I'd say you should tell the doctor about the marijuana use.  Sounds like that could be important here.
  • HygeniusHygenius ArizonaPosts: 20Silver Member
    edited July 2012
    Your husband's post asked the question was related to you being too tired for sex but not too tired to work out.  To me, that is a fair question. The fact is, by your own description above, you are working out every day and by your own words, you make it your first priority.  

    On the day in question, after your 12 hour day, did you work out?  If I am to believe what you wrote, the answer is yes.  Could you have chosen to have sex with your husband instead of working out?  Clearly the answer is yes.  If you had the energy to work out, you could have chosen you use that energy for sex, but decided not to.  

    Your post talks about a lot of things, issues and feelings, but at the end of the day, very simply put, you made working out a higher priority than sex with your husband.  And as a guy, if my wife or girlfriend came home, worked out and then begged off sex, I would be furious. 

    Please don't take any of this as an attack on your commitment to your marriage or making things better. You asked for feedback... so here it is.... I am sure others will have something to say as well.
    First, thank you @sf 64 for your comments. They started a very needed and helpful dialogue between my husband and I.  I completely agree with your first statement in regards to the marijuana usage having a vast effect on my libido. No doubt. This is the #2 reason for quitting, the #1 being we wanted to start a family and drugs are not conducive to that. That being said, I feel you might have missed a LARGE part of my #1 statement.  I work out for depression. This was recommend to me by a license therapist as a way to control my depression. It was recommended MAINLY due to the fact that we want to start a family and almost ALL anti-depressant /anti-anxiety medications cause decreased sex drive, low libido but more importantly, can cause heart birth defects in fetus/infants. Should you be on this medication and become pregnant, bad things can happen.  So..my question is this.  If your Wife/Girlfriend was recommended exercise from a licensed therapist for depression, was getting good results from it such that it was absolutely necessary for her mental health and day to day life, would you suggest she forgo it to be more sexually available to you knowing it could cause her harm or regression back into illness or depression?   I admit I might have misunderstood what you meant and am simply asking for clarification.  I have to workout to deal with my depression. Do you suggest I don't work out to save energy for sex?  FYI- A few times recently, after I have worked out, I have then initiated sex with my husband.  Sweaty sex has been better sex. 

    Linanati-  Thank you very much for your comments as well.  Your feedback was very kind and very helpful. We did try seeing a doctor a couple of times in the past and they prescribed Wellbutrin, Lexapro and Prozac at each different appointment. My husband couldn't maintain taking the pills on a daily basis long enough to see any results. (His words, not mine).  

    Thank you both for your candor.
  • thunderthunder Posts: 138Silver Member
    It sounds like a lot is going on between the 2 of you.

    - Don't have kids until these issues are sorted out.
    - You, clearly, both have a ton of resentment towards each other that is making moving forward very difficult. 

    I very heavily recommend "No More Mr Nice Guy" (NMMNG) to x1134x.  He needs to absorb that first before MMSL.   To me that is the first step.  Then revisit MMLS and everything else.

    x1134x - I am going to hand you a very bitter red pill to swallow.  You need to stop blaming your wife.  I am not saying she is blameless but before that you need to point the finger at yourself.  ED issues?  Look at yourself to fix it, not her.  She's not interested?  Look at yourself not her.  Bad/frustrating relationships?  Its you.  Misleading all of us about your level of exercise?  Why?  Its you.   This is what NMMNG will teach you. 
    Stop the self-pity vomit puke as the book would say. 
    You need to take charge of your own life.  Blame yourself for what is wrong and then fix it.  Only once you get past that understanding can you heal your relationship - or move on to a new one if after you've done those things you realize its no longer you.

    I am speaking from experience and I believe many of us who have fixed our sex life and relationships are coming from the same place.


    Hygenius
  • PhoenixDownPhoenixDown TejasPosts: 10,280Gold Women
    I don't have much to add, just wanted to commend you for coming here and posting in a constructive manner that started some communication with your guy. It's obvious you want to make things work, both of you, and that's a great thing. 

    My condolences on the loss of your brother, I know that must be so hard to deal with.

    LinanatiThe_Dude
  • SerenitySerenity Posts: 9,984Senior Moderator**

    @Hygenius  Posting here took guts!  As a wife who has been through the whole ED thing with my husband, I want to tell you that it can get better.  My husband and I both read the Forum together (see thread 'Does your Captain Know You're Here?), and our marriage (read sex life) is improving 100%. It took both of us taking that stupid red pill, and becoming (maybe brutally) honest with each other.

    There is an ED thread on the Forum, and maybe we FO's with husbands experiencing ED problems need to get active on there and exchange some info.

    I want to encourage you to not give up. Yea, you have some structural issues to fix, but that is so do-able, especially when you have the resources available through MMSL.

    "We are what we repeatedly do; excellence, then, is not an act but a habit."


    Website   http://lowtwife.com/

    ParaverseHygeniusThe_Dude
  • Joskin_NoddJoskin_Nodd AshwanPosts: 4,064Silver Member
    @Hygenius: "I performed the house hold chores 95% of time."

    Does your husband agree with that assessment? I ask because I've seen, and experienced, that guys with a lot of beta who offer a fair amount of beta support have it all marginalized or eliminated due to be at an even or lower sex rank, and being too beta around everything. 

    Thus, they may do more than 5% around the house, but it's literally impossible (not a choice) for their spouse to see it, because they are too broadly beta and what support they do provide is wiped from the books. Things like mowing the lawn or painting rooms or fixing electrical stuff or maintaining the computer also don't count to that number, because "guys are supposed to do that stuff". Not saying this is the case with you, only that it's not uncommon that too much beta generally ends up with everything the husband does provide in the way of beta support being discounted. 

    ED: I know, I'm a broken record, but there is plenty of evidence that porn usage (even not heavy) can deplete the dopamine receptors important to achieving and maintaing healthy erections. Which is still an issue is debated, but there are many men who discovered giving up porn and masturbation (and yes, sometimes orgasms entirely) for 90+ days permanently fixed non-medical ED problems. Ergo, it's not you, and it's not even really your husband. It's just depleted dopamine receptors, and something that is not easily addressed (the dopamine receptor depletion leads to more dopamine production which makes it a behavioral addiction, like a gambling addiction, and it's no easier to quit). If he has used pornography as a release from a dissatisfactory sex life, he needs to stop, and masturbation as well (at least until such time as ED is no longer a problem). Blue balls are common (and, trust me, a very real and even physically painful phenomenon) but, in the end, the sex is much better for everybody. A healthy male can have sex, reach orgasm, and then do it again (while lasting longer) shortly thereafter, which may help increase your satisfaction as well. But definitely: cut out recreational drugs as well (and, surely, no tobacco). And reduce other vasoconstrictors, like caffeine, and avoid depressants like alcohol. 

    But, though it may make you feel bad, he clearly wants to have sex with you, so: it's not you. It's likely a combination of factors that can be discovered and addressed over time. 

    However, the most important thing to comment on is your presence here. Your approach to having a healthy marriage with your husband (and his presence here as well) is an excellent sign for the fulfilling relationship that's in your future. You've suffered a genuine tragedy, yet you're still present here, working on your marriage. Very good signs.

    Your husband wants to be more attractive to you, and wants your relationship to be both more intimate and more satisfying. You clearly want the same thing. With both of you on that same page, all the rest of it will slowly come into place. 

    I know you are hurt and embarrassed, but both of you being present here is a sign that you can both have an extremely rewarding and fulfilling relationship in the future. Your willingness to participate and clarify your point of view, and talk calmly and rationally about your issues, suggests that a trial separation is not a good idea.

    It sounds to me like your both going in the right direction. Your husband should eliminate any medical cause for the ED (this is doubtful), and work to fix it (no drugs, alcohol, depressants, vasoconstrictors, porn or masturbation) and provide more beta support around the house (perhaps), and more alpha in regards to decision making, responding to fitness tests, and finding fun things to do. 

    Again, I would skip the trial separation at this point. See if you can stick together, support each other, and try to connect to each other by doing fun stuff together, teasing, working together (go shopping together, clean together, make the bed together in the morning), and making earnest efforts to fornicate like rabbits. 

    "There are no right biscuits." – Mandrill

    Linanati
  • x1134xx1134x Posts: 1,265Member
    edited July 2012
    @thunder thanks for your response.  I'd like to ask you where and what I said in that post that sounded like "blaming her".  I'm not trying to say you're wrong, I'd sincerely like to know, because I get my wife telling me "why are you blaming me?" or "so I'm to blame" and find myself saying "no, I didn't assign any blame, I stated facts, if I were assigning blame there would have followed an '. . . and therefore its YOUR fault'"  So I'm sure there's some communication skills I could learn there, because internally, I never blame anyone but myself for my unhappiness. Most of the time it is in a non-constructive way though "I just don't deserve to be happy". 
    My post IMHO was a statement of factual circumstances, and a plea for guidance.  "How the hell do *I* move sex to the front of her 'want to get done today' list?"  I have also been saying "I'm not mad at you, I'm mad at me." long before MMSL. In my mind everything is already my fault. This makes it easy to accept that I'm 100% responsible for everything, I'm already wired that way. Unfortunately I take on responsibility for some things with the self-hate rationalization hamster, and all of my good self-esteem I've stuffed in her back pocket.  I was abandoned by my mother at 10 months, raised by my awesome grandmother until 3, then beat "like a red-headed stepchild" (literally) by my stepmother for the next 10 or so years. When I'd tell my dad, I'd get the "just grin and bear it, you'll be out of the house, and not have to deal with her in 5, 4, 3, 2, 1 years."  Never a "you don't deserve to be treated like that so I'll bother myself to start a fight over it."  I know he taught me to be non-confrontational and I need to work on that but as it stands, I seek the approval of my woman to feel any self-worth. I'm working on it.

    So if my wife is making me feel like a man with sex, or texts like "you make other men look like little girls", I'm flying high, wearing my watch, taking my pocket knife with me, working circles around my peers at work, helping other people, happy as a clam being a real man, feeling like my wife is actually lucky to be with me.  If we're fighting, I'm a worthless piece of red-headed shit, that doesn't deserve anything, isn't capable of anything, and am just all around detestable even to myself. My beta though process for years has been:  "If I'm doing everything she asks, and jumping right on it like a soldier, and working all day on things she says I should work on and she still doesn't want me, it must be because I'm just un-want-able.  Why do I bother trying? I should just accept that I don't deserve to be happy"

    I don't really see how I can fix ED issues by myself,  I can take 100% responsibility for getting it fixed, but until we're doing it and doing it well, it won't be fixed and that requires a partner.  I doubt highly that THC is a factor in the physical portion, as it works fine and indefinitely when masturbating which the doctors I've consulted online say that rules out physical ED issues, its all in my head.  I think the masturbating constantly and self-hatred is/was the cause all along.  That being said, I'm done with pot, am sitting at day 20 right now, with essentially no desire to do it anymore, so whatever factor it was its gotta be going the other way now, and time should tell.  Its not like they have a "reverses the side effects of pot" prescription.  I've also sworn off masturbation, much harder to stop thinking about than pot.

    As far as the exercise goes, it didn't seem to germane to the topic aside from saying my physical shape is already quite good. Technically it is correct, but I accept it could be interpreted in ways that are not the full truth.  I could definitely use more cardio work, but I'm at 10% body fat right now and was referred to as the statue of "David" not more than 3 days ago.  So unless she's lying I think my physique is acceptable.  Amusingly she stated the same thing "been working out for years" which I called her on and made her edit, since she was calling me out on that particular bit.  I've only missed working out due to an accident I had at work, where they recommended rest for 3 days.  I'm committed to hitting all aspects of the MAP with all my abilities.

    Like I told my wife, MMSL didn't make me go out looking for MMSL.  I did that myself, because I know the problem is likely fixed with me working on me.  My wife is a high quality Woman (with a capital W), and rarely makes mistakes.  If I could just eliminate my crap, we'd be a hell of a lot better. Many things in Athol's book she's been telling me for years, just not in the way that made sense to my mind.  Thank God for @Athol.  Thank you for recommending NMMNG I'll buy it and read it as well.

    "My upbringing and choices up till now have gotten me to where I am, they do not, however, determine where I will go next".  I keep trying on this new mantra the instant I get the "I'm completely worthless" thoughts.  If I can see the ends of an item, I can follow-through till the end.  I can take a laptop completely apart, solder in new chips, troubleshoot a motherboard and put it all back together working. I can solve a rubik's cube in less than a minute. I know I'm more capable than most men.  This relationship many times feels like a fifty million piece puzzle that i'll never solve.  After reading MMSL, I feel I at least have what the picture should look like when complete, and that motivates me like crazy to get to the end of this tunnel, which is more of just a big hole that I myself dug.  I know I'll only climb a few feet a day, but one day should add on to the next, just like one day of ignoring it after another got me down here.
    Most women unwittingly ruin the sex as a reward by being so shitty in bed during the sex, that it becomes a form of punishment rather than a reward. - Athol Kay.
  • Joskin_NoddJoskin_Nodd AshwanPosts: 4,064Silver Member
    @x1134x:

    ""I just don't deserve to be happy"
    Blame is not constructive. An honest appraisal of cause and effect makes blame irrelevant. Looking for new approaches to improve circumstances and interactions makes blame even less relevant. That was yesterday. I recall what I was doing, and perhaps it didn't work (or maybe it did), but I think I can do even better. 

    Blame and reproach aren't learning tools. "Today, I'm going to do it better." That's learning. A much better approach. 

    "Deserve" is also a loaded term. The point is, you can be happy. Or, you can do things and live in a way that does not make you happy. Deserve is not the point. Improve yourself and do things that lead to a more fulfilling life. Whether or not you "deserve" something is irrelevant: are you doing the things that create fulfillment in your life, that get you closer to your spouse? The improve things all around? If not, then get to it. Think of new things to do. If an old approach doesn't work, try a different one. It's not that you don't deserve to be happy, or that you deserve to be. It's that the old approach was less than ideal, so try a new one. 

    "If we're fighting, I'm a worthless piece of red-headed shit, that doesn't deserve anything, isn't capable of anything, and am just all around detestable even to myself."
    I know the feeling. Well, not the part about being red-headed (thank goodness!). But it sounds to me like you're too dependent on outside circumstances for the maintenance of your internal state. Your internal state is internal. The more alpha you are, the less likely you are to feel this way. I'm a natural beta who has been picking up alpha info for years, but I'm still a natural beta, and conduct myself in a very beta way much of the time. This is the area where I am perhaps the most alpha, and it benefits me tremendously. If I'm fighting with my wife, we're fighting, and that sucks (I mostly opt out of fights, though, because how I feel about myself is not tied up in the outcome of those fights, or my wire's moods—almost all of the time, but I slip now and again) . . . but if we're fighting, that's what's happening. It doesn't reflect on me in any negative way. I'm still an awesome guy. Like the rain, it's something that's happening, and I need to find a positive approach, or retreat and regroup. 
    Lots of times, fitness tests that led to fights I don't even consider fights. I just call bs, and do it again, and again. Sometimes I have to find new ways to do this, but I don't let my wife set the terms, so that we can then fight about it. Sometimes, my wife does classic wifely "fight starting" maneuvers, and when my internal state is good (and, most of the time, it is) I don't take the bait Viola, no fight, and no chance for me to let such an outside circumstance affect your mood.

    "There are no right biscuits." – Mandrill

  • sf64sf64 San FranciscoPosts: 1,904Silver Member
    @hygenius -- I would like to join the others in complimenting you on actually joining in a dialogue.  That is what the forum is about.

    In response to your comment about working out and depression.  I totally get it.  After a tragedy in my life, I had depression and exercise was part of the solution for me as well.  There is some great information on the Mayo Clinic website about this.  Very specifically, exercise releases endorphin's into the brain.  

    The problem is that it can become an avoidance mechanism.. a crutch if you will... for avoiding things you don't want to deal with.  And from what I know, the overall beneficial effects are depression are not diminished by missing a day of exercise and the benefits kick in after about 20 min of cardio.

    While I freely admit that I am bringing my baggage and issues to the table.... exercise became my get out of jail free card when I was depressed.  It was a great tool for rationalization.... I can't clean the house because I need to exercise... if I don't exercise, the depression will get me.  I can't spend time with the kids because I need to exercise.  I can't..... fill in the blank.

    It seems to me (and I may be projecting) that exercise has replaced marijuana as your crutch.

    And to the specific question about would I be pissed if my significant other who suffers from depression picked exercise over sex... my answer remains, yes, I would be very upset.

    1.  You don't need to exercise every day in order to have it help depression.
    2.  You could have sex and then go exercise.  Perhaps you only get in a partial workout but you certainly could do 20 min of cardio.

    Only you know the answer, but it feels like it is a way to avoid having sex, which you have said is "frustrating and disappointing."  

    @ x1134x 

    I am going to join the chorus of those who say you need to look at yourself and fix yourself.  The journey from beta to Alpha is not quick or easy.  And you can't just wake up one morning and announce to the the world, I am the AMOG and expect everyone to jump up and salute.  If what your wife says in accurate, you are still very early in the process that Athol describes.

    One of the hardest things for me to wrap my head around in my Red Pill journey was the fact that I and I alone control the major drivers of getting sexual attention from women.

    1. I had to be in shape and I mean, really in shape.  
    2. Be in charge of my own life and actively work through a bunch of psychological issues from the present, recent past and distant past.
    3. Kick ass at work
    4. Find the right mix of Alpha and beta in your personal life.

    Once I got these four things in alignment... I could not believe (as one person put it) that I had these new superpowers.  I am currently dating a woman who is way younger than me, is gorgeous, loves the role of FO and can't wait for sexy time.  

    But I had to do do the work.  If I were 40lbs overweight, had a shitty job, was dealing with all kinds of psychological baggage, and was a total beta boy....well... she would be running for the hills, not for the bed. 

    Note - If you a FO with a Lazy Bear or Low-T husband, ignore everything I say. It probably doesn't apply
    "As he works on his MAP, he's going to do things that piss you off. He has to."  - Steu2817
    "In a world of Alpha's there is no peace for anyone.....welcome to Somalia enjoy your stay" - Highlander2




    LinanatiJohn_Q_GaltHygenius
  • Joskin_NoddJoskin_Nodd AshwanPosts: 4,064Silver Member
    "I don't really see how I can fix ED issues by myself,  I can take 100% responsibility for getting it fixed, but until we're doing it and doing it well, it won't be fixed and that requires a partner."

    Of course you can. No porn, no masturbation, no depressants, eliminate vasoconstrictors, no recreational drug use, healthy diet, lots of exercise, reduce or eliminate alcohol. Go to the doctor to rule out medical problems. If your on anti-depressants, get off of them. Stick to it for a few months, and the ED is gone. 

    The ED has nothing to do with your wife. If you're attracted to her, and want to have sex with her, she's already done her part (on that front). It's your job to produce the wood. It's her job to have you putting it to good use on a regular basis. 

    " I can solve a rubik's cube in less than a minute."

    Holy Christmas! I just tried to work on one for five minutes the other day, and just made it worse. If I were a woman, I'd start throwing out major IOIs on that one. ;) 

    Under a minute? That man is something special (I'm serious, I can't imagine the processing power of the brain that can do that). 

    BTW, that has to involve a lot of being able to see how step one leads to step three all the way to step fifty. Engage that ability in your approach to your relationship . . . you've got a powerful calculator there that if trained to other tasks might do you some impressive good. 

    "which is more of just a big hole that I myself dug."

    Which is what most guys do, and what the culture encourages, which is how so many men end up in exactly the same place in their relationships. Thus the blue pill/red pill metaphor. It's not about what's uniquely wrong with you, or anybody, it's about Seeing The Matrix. And proceeding accordingly, once you do. 

    Previously, you could not have been expected to do much different. Now, you have the opportunity to act on new knowledge. It's an exciting time!

    "There are no right biscuits." – Mandrill

    x1134x
  • PhoenixDownPhoenixDown TejasPosts: 10,280Gold Women
    You say that being able to masterbate rules out ED, and it's all in your head... I have 3 questions.

    1) Did a doctor tell you that, or did you assume that?

    2) Could you talk to a doc about getting an ED drug prescription anyway? If you're having these symptoms, even if it is in your head, the drug would help you get over that hurtle without any horrible side effects. Seems like Cealis (sp?) would be good for it. 

    3) Since it's in your head, have you been referred to a psychologist? They can do wonders. If the problem is your head, get your head fixed. :)

    roeLinanatiAverageMarriedGuyHygenius
  • roeroe Posts: 445Silver Member
    @x1134x - Strongly agree with @redpillwifey.  I think it's very probable your ED is related to your issues with your step-mother, and a counsellor can help with that.  Sorry if this is obvious, or comes off as armchair psychology, but if it's right, it means you can only fix your ED by addressing this underlying issue.

    "The good news is you don’t have to become a romance novel hero, you just have to become her hero...  A woman doesn’t have to be perfect to arouse her husband, she just has to be his Playmate."   -Dalrock

  • Joskin_NoddJoskin_Nodd AshwanPosts: 4,064Silver Member
    "You say that being able to masterbate rules out ED"

    Uh, no. Constant masturbation, especially to pornography or even pornographic fantasy, can contribute to ED. 

    I believe the drug company that produces Cialis has applied to get it prescribed as a psychological med for the treatment of ED (extending their patent). As there are cases of folks who took it, found their ED gone, and then forgot to take it . . . and still found their ED gone. Didn't I hear a story like that here? 

    It might be something to try. A psychologist may help, but cannot do anything as regards depletion of dopamine receptors. Only swearing off pornography (first and foremost) and masturbation (for an extended period, well, well, well past discomfort—and sometimes it gets worse before it gets (much, much) better when doing the "porn/masturbation reboot") can fix that. Assuming that's been done, cutting out recreational drugs, alcohol, anti-depressants, vasoconstrictors (nicotine, caffeine) should be tried (perhaps not all at one time), as well. 

    Everything described above takes some time to work. Sometimes it takes a week, sometimes it takes months. In the interim, Cialis can be tried right away. It could be just the extra tweak you need.

    "There are no right biscuits." – Mandrill

    LinanatiHD_Chick
  • LinanatiLinanati Posts: 1,606Member

    @x1134x

    You've mentioned childhood abuse, and it sounds like that is still a problem for you.  You need to get help for that.  You can't let that affect your adult life and your marriage.  Your best revenge against your stepmother is to have the happiest life you can.

    I was physically abused by my mother in childhood as well, and had depression from that.  It affected how I acted towards my husband early in our marriage.  I didn't want to ruin the best thing in my life over what happened in the past.  Plus, I just didn't want to live like that.  So I dealt with the depression.  I did it without drugs, even though I was semi-suicidal.  Cognitive behavioral therapy really works, if you are determined and persistent with it.

    I'm happy now, which really upsets my mom because I'm not living my life the way she wants me to.  Well, tough.  She doesn't have the right to influence my decisions now - she lost that years ago when she decided to take her anger and frustration out on her small, helpless, innocent daughter.  Taking charge of my own life, my own emotions, my own mental state, and refusing to be a victim anymore or to allow her to control me in any way, was the most effective revenge I could have taken, although I didn't do it for that.  I did it because I wanted something I'd never had - a happy life.  The revenge aspect was a very nice side benefit.  I love it that she hates it.

    You need to talk with a good therapist.  Describe what happened, any specific incidents you can recall, and how you felt as a child.  Tell him (and I would recommend you see a man for this) about the mixture of terror and rage you felt while she was beating you.  What thoughts went through your head?  Did you want to stab her, strangle her?  Did you feel like a bad person for having these "bad" thoughts?  Did you feel betrayed by your dad because he didn't care enough to stop her?  You need to get it all off your chest.  He's not going to be shocked; he's heard much worse.

    For some people, childhood is what they had to endure to reach adulthood.  You just happen to be one of those people.  It's not your fault, but now that you are an adult and can control your own life, you need to overcome it.  If your stepmother is still alive and still married to your dad or otherwise in contact with you, she'll hate it.  If she's dead, she'll do somersaults in her grave.

    You can't really be captain of your marriage unless you are first captain of your fate*.  As an adult, you make your own life.  Until you do, I don't see how you can be in charge of your marriage.

    *Or is it captain of your soul?  I never can remember.  :-)

    roeHygeniusx1134x
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